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Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby hsoft on Wed Jul 06, 2011 1:41 pm

Praxis wrote:Because, generally speaking, open source means no money/hobby development.

Listen--I respect your view, but I think you're wrong. I think many users are fair. I think most users are...lazy. And cheap. If there's an easy download that's free, they'll do it. If there is no easy download that's free, but an easy way to pay ,then many will take it (the iTunes effect). I think that there are many, many developers out there who don't care about intellectual property despite their avocation. An open source version would siphon a ton of sales, even if there's no downloadable binary (we *are* developers after all, we can get it built). And a downloadable pirated binary would become available anyway; heck, it *will* be available even as things stand now. There'll be a ton of demand.


I agree that users are lazy, I say so in my fairware introduction. It's a point I already address with fairware by making the "nag screen" easier to remove by contributing than by figuring how to "unfairly" remove it.

My experiment shows interesting results with my main application: All hours I invest in it are paid at a rate that is very similar to the money I was receiving when it was closed source, so empirical evidence seems to be on my side here. I wrote an article about that success at http://www.hardcoded.net/articles/fairw ... -works.htm

Praxis wrote:Perhaps most importantly: it's an issue of *control*. Jon, thank goodness, seems to be taking extreme care in how his creation is being crafted. Have you seen Notepad++ lately? It's good for what it is, and has tons of features, but it doesn't have people raving about it like TextMate (and now, Sublime Text). The way it goes right now, Jon has every bit of control over his interpretation of what a text editor ought to be like. Happily, I rather agree with him (and apparently most of you do, too).


I think you're making a mistake here by associating open source with "free for all" development where everyone adds his own little feature and we end up with an unmaintainable mess. It's very possible to maintain control of an open source application, all you have to do is to avoid accepting all code contributions.

Praxis wrote:I have every bit of confidence that should Jon not wish to make money from ST any more, he would open source it. No, I don't know him. He doesn't know me. I'm just not that concerned, though. I respect those who are concerned, but I just can't bring myself to tell someone to give away their work. You want to invest all that time and make it open source? Great. Just don't insist that others do the work and release it on your terms.


I don't insist that Jon releases his work as open source. It's his work, he does whatever he wants. I'm merely expressing my discomfort at the close-ness of ST's source, mentioning risks for the user and pointing to a past case where users were hurt by this (TextMate). You may do wishful thinking all you want, but it is still possible for this to happen with ST, a likely case being ST making a lot of money and Jon not wanting to work on it anymore. In this case, Jon has no incentive for either working on ST or open sourcing it, and this would hurt the users.
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Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby adresden on Sun Dec 15, 2013 6:58 pm

The fact that ST is not open source is just ridiculous. Please correct this situation as soon as possible before something better comes along that IS open source.
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Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby hsu on Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:00 am

Why? Do you think all software should be open source? Would you be willing to pay Jon all the money he won't be making from Sublime Text? I think he'll consider open sourcing it then...
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Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby jbrooksuk on Tue Dec 17, 2013 11:14 am

adresden wrote:The fact that ST is not open source is just ridiculous. Please correct this situation as soon as possible before something better comes along that IS open source.

Your post is ridiculous. People have to make money. It's an economical fact.
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Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby jpambrun on Tue Dec 17, 2013 6:55 pm

I bought ST2 and I would be willing to pay another 60$ if ST3 was made open source. The sporadic development and inadequate support is worrying. The text editor is such an essential tool for most of us and requires such a significant time investment that the uncertainty surrounding its future is unbearable.

Given the circumstances, I will not be spending any more money on ST without any reasonable assurances concerning its continued development.
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Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby thecrumb on Tue Dec 17, 2013 7:26 pm

Honestly I'd probably be willing to pay/donate *MORE* if it was open sourced.

Usually this time of year I visit all the open source tools I use and make a yearly donation. It's not much but over the years I've shelled out way more than I paid for ST2.

I really like Sublime and paid for v2 but am on the fence for v3. Looking at both Brackets (open source) or biting the bullet and getting a license for IntelliJ.

Both seem to have better communication with their customers.
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Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby iamntz on Tue Dec 17, 2013 9:23 pm

Honestly I'd probably be willing to pay/donate *MORE* if it was open sourced.

There are so many awesome Sublime plugins that accept donations. Just to name a few: package control, bracket highlighter, emmet and so on.
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Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby Regnareb on Wed Dec 18, 2013 11:24 am

Why are you talking about plugins and such? It has nothing to do with the discussion.

And stop saying that you can't make money with open source software, that's a huge misconception.
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Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby iamntz on Wed Dec 18, 2013 11:39 am

And stop saying that you can't make money with open source software, that's a huge misconception.

You can make money by offering support for open source software, not by selling it. And in many cases support is more time consuming than coding.

Anyhow, it's a free world. You can use any other open source software; you are not stuck with sublime in any way. Not sure why every now and then some random dude pop up and claim that he/she sublime should be open source...

I wonder how many of you went to adobe or autodesk and ask to open source photoshop, 3dmax, etc...
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Re: Secret dream : make Sublime Text open source

Postby jmansour on Wed Dec 18, 2013 4:01 pm

The funny thing is that Sublime Text is basically already available for free. I know a bunch of people who have been using the unregistered version for a long time, either because they are cheap or they just can't afford to buy it (students).

How about not open-sourcing the program in the strict sense, but just releasing the source-code under a non-free license? For example, to use the source you must have a valid ST license, and you may not use the source in other programs, and may not redistribute it commercially? And you have to redistribute the source with the binaries if you make any changes (a bit like GPL)?

This would not expand the circle of those who are not paying for ST. People who don't care about Jon's income, or who can't afford buying ST, already pirate it, and will continue. People who do care, and who do obey licenses, would still pay for it.

Such a non-free license would still let you customize ST for personal use. Someone could implement the long-requested feature of file-type icons, for example. If a new feature is well-coded, then it could even be ported back into the main branch.
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